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Author Topic: Everyone Please Welcome RavynG!  (Read 7021 times)

RavynG

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Re: Everyone Please Welcome RavynG!
« Reply #20 on: February 11, 2011, 03:02:05 PM »
Let me start at the end of my JW life, as I am sure more of you will be able to relate to it better than the beginning and middle. It is not so different from the soap-opera dramas that some XJWs have been thru. (This is from the beginning of my "book"--unpublished--hence the explanatory wording in places.)

part 1...
WHY I FINALLY HAD THE GUTS TO LEAVE JWs:

(This is written in the form of 3 letters I wrote about 5 years ago and if they lose you at some point--keep reading you will pick it up again...I have changed some names and added some explanations in parenthesis for clarity)

bapt: May 25, 1974
pio: Jan 1 1980-Dec 17, 1995
cong:
Woodbine NJ
Forest Park GA
Warner Robins GA
Collierville TN
Bridgeton NJ
La Habra CA
Downey CA
Pico Rivera CA
Hemet CA
San Jacinto CA
Post Falls ID
Brattleboro VT
Corona CA


Doctrinal deconversion:

Dear Dad,
The religion that I grew up with, with you is not the religion promoted by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society-and it never was. My whole life with you, you taught me 'truths' that WTBS did not hold, telling me not to share them with others at the Hall because not everyone was 'ready' for the 'truth'. The very idea that you are of the anointed is against their dogma. I spent 15 years as a pioneer, put in more hours in field service than anyone else in my family, and I can tell you that what WTBS teaches and believes is not what you taught me to believe. The reason I left was because my conscience could no longer tolerate the corruption and abuse of that group. You are living in a fantasy world if you think the way you believe and the way you live(I am speaking of not actively being involved in the field service--not anything personal)are acceptable to them!

I believe in what you taught me about God. I have not left the Truth. At this point in my life I do not even consider myself Christian.

Now you may feel that you spent more time deeply involved in the inner workings as an elder, but that was a long time ago. Things have changed since then, and you are no longer in the loop. And if you remember correctly you were always on the edge anyway--not exactly a team player. I started seeing some dangerous patterns in 1994 with WTBS. Then in 1996-7 I was personally asked by A WTBS attorney to lie in court to cover up a scandal at Bethel. I can give you as many details as you wish to know including names and dates---but I never thought you cared to know about it. I spent 23 years involved in WTBS with you, and another 11 involved with them without you. It was not my years with you that decided my leaving. Did you know that in 1985 they changed the Baptism questions? I didn't until I did some research. When I got baptized I made a vow to Jehovah, Jesus, and to follow the leadings of Holy Spirit. In 1985 they changed that to following the instructions of WTBS. I did not make a vow to an organization. I made a vow to God, His Son and the Holy Spirit's leadings IN MY LIFE.

If there was one single thing that took me out, it was a careful study(with no ulterior motive--as it was something I just came upon accidentally) of Revelation 7: 9 and 11 in the WTBS' own Kingdom Interlinear. Briefly, in verse 9 it is talking about the Great Crowd, and in verse 11 it is talking about the angels. Now unless the angels are going to be on the Earth, the Great Crowd is in Heaven. The Greek word that identifies where these two groups are is exactly the same. There is not degrees of 'before the throne' indicated here, nor does the Greek word used support that stretch of a theory(for this I spoke with a professor of ancient languages at Harvard). There are other Greek words that could have been used to differentiate a different place, but that is not how the inspired writer wrote it. It says that the angels, in the circle of throne-Heaven, will worship in the same place as the Great Crowd-who came OUT of the Earth--and that place is before the throne. This is not talking about the 144,000. Verse 14 reiterates the place where the Great Crowd are, using the phrase again-and adds the phrase 'in the divine habitation of him'---so now WTBS would have us believe that not only do the angels come down to the Earth to worship but that God himself lives here? I know they explain it that his tent will spread over the Earth---but that is not what the SCRIPTURE says. The scripture says that the Great Crowd will join him in his tent. No where does it indicate that this tent will be on Earth. No where. And the logic that they use to say that his tent will be extended to the Earth is flawed logic, making scripture fit WTBS' own dogma. THAT is criminal. To manipulate the Word of God in order to cover your own butts! It sickens me.

So I fell in with no 'apostates' or read no 'forbidden' books. It was the WTBS' own literature that took me out. I did not forsake the Truth. The Truth set me free. And I decided this on December 17, 1995. A year and a half before I ever met Lee. He had nothing to do with it.

Now as far as my Church wedding which is what I am assuming stimulated this email from you, can you blame me? I planned my wedding since I was 6 years old. WTBS took away my youth, my prospects for marriage and a family ((I had a tubal ligation done in 1994 on the 'strong' advice of an elder(I was told if I got married and had a baby I would be removed as a pioneer) who was trying to match me up with a brother who did not want children--of course after the surgery the brother moved away never to be heard of again!)) Lee and I had a beautiful private wedding on a beach at midnight with a few close friends, but it was not how either of us ever pictured a wedding. We wanted photographs and cake and all the stuff everyone else gets. It was a first wedding for both of us. So I did what I had to do and we had our wedding. It was lovely, but bitter sweet, knowing that it was 20 years too late and none of my family cared enough to be there. So chalk up yet another one for WTBS.

If you were not guilty of the so-called 'sin' you were disfellowshipped for, as you explained to me that Jehovah can judge the extenuating circumstamces, then blame the WTBS for causing this rift in our relationship too. I was not allowed to talk to you for how long? 8 years or more? On the penalty of my being removed as a pioneer--that is what I was repeatedly told. Do you know how it ripped me up to hear your voice when you called to tell me about Jeremy and not be able to even give you a hug? Not get to know Ruth or Matthew? And I wrote the WTBS asking advice on how to deal with family relationships under the circumstances, I pleaded with them, and was flat out told that I could not have anything to do with you period. YOU were considered apostate by every congregation I attended. The letters I got back from WTBS forbid me to even PRAY for you! But you never knew that because when you did come back I did not want to hurt your feelings or undermine your supposedly weak faith(their words not mine). So Dad you just don't know what I put up with from them in those 11 years. I have tried to put it behind me. But now I have a hard time finding any solace in faith. The mention of the name Jehovah is painful to me. And I have studied and studied scripture and theology and I just can't get past the idea that maybe the whole Christian thing was just a way to enslave people from the beginning.

Whatever Russell had, Rutherford lost. Same with the Mormons, Joseph Smith had a rare spirituality, but Brigham Young turned it into a business enterprise. The first Christian Church, whether anyone likes it or not was called Catholic. I think it had something unique until it became the political pawn of Constantine, and then with the final chapters of the Roman Empire, Christianity went into hiding with the fanatics and the extremists. I have read many Gnostic texts and I find none of them in contradiction of the Bible Canons, but in great contradiction of Church teaching. The thing is, I don't identify with the Bible as a holy Book or the God of the Bible as my God. I am not Jewish. I don't want to be Jewish. It is not my culture or inheritance. I don't belong. I think maybe you can empathize with the feeling of not belonging...
Religion is such a small limited piece of spirituality for humans. The world is such a bigger place than cults would have you believe. The Universe belongs to everyone. Truth is relative here on Earth. And the idea that there is only one secret way and only one elite group of people practicing it, is American Protestant Fundamentalism at its most dangerous. It is trap.

Sincerely,
Ravyn

---------------------------------------------------------

Emotional Deconversion:

(this is MY truth--I realize that any one I mention probably has a different perspective on it and I might have inadvertantly got the sequence or dates mixed up--but there is no purposeful deception in what I write.)

this is a long story.....

In 1993 I was being treated for my illness by a homeopath and seeing a therapist for my dysfunctional childhood--both of which were disapproved of by the JWs. But I did them anyway. Then in 1994 I helped a friend leave an abusive husband and move across country with her three kids, and I followed shortly afterward(I had planned on the move--she was an unseen complication at the last minute). I had been a missionary(pioneer) living with a sister missionary for 14 years at this time. The sister I lived with was named M. She had also been my nurse when I was very sick, but as I got into a remission she started to get emotionally ill herself. Sometimes I think it was because of all the pressure from the congregation and the fact that I was changing and she was somehow losing what she saw as an advantage--she was a very jealous and competitive person(the oldest of 5 girls!). So anyway she was DXd with bipolar disorder and put on some heavy duty meds. The next year-1995- I lost 100 pounds, and we decided to take on two troubled teens(brother and sister) as foster kids who's mother happened to be in our new congregation. BIG MISTAKE. I went thru the training by the state, we were approved, yada yada yada, but the congregation saw this as an opportunity to get around the law by allowing the mother access to the kids at the Kingdom Hall that she was denied otherwise. It got so bad that I offered to move to another Hall while I had the kids. But no, the mother caused so much scandal that not only did I lose the kids(the integrity of my home was jeaopardized) but I was also accused of disobeying the elders and was removed as a missionary(pioneer) after 15 years of faithful service. I was devastated. That was December 17, 1995 in Brattleboro, Vermont. Meanwhile, M is freaking out being so far from her family(she had been away from them for 12 years as a missionary, and she was separated from a husband-against JW policy-that whole time also). She also started spending money out of my accounts and using my credit cards, and not paying bills I thought she was paying. When you live with someone for 12 years--you just don't think such a thing could happen-but it did. It took me about 6 months to figure it out. My friend with the three kids who fled her husband died of a rare heart condition(PPH) brought on by years of abuse. She was 27, her youngest was 18 months. I also nursed, until her death,  a woman who died of a brain cancer for the congregation, named Doris.  Very hectic and emotionally draining year for me.

part 1 cont...
I will get back to you-I will have to think about it.

RavynG

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Re: Everyone Please Welcome RavynG!
« Reply #21 on: February 11, 2011, 03:03:27 PM »
part 1 cont...

Then one day I was in the wrong place at the wrong time.

I went to visit 'Bethel' farm where Watchtower prints the magazines etc. I went off the tour to the little private graveyard and saw a fresh grave with a name on it I knew. I asked about it and was told the young man died of an aneurysm. I used to babysit this kid in Georgia when I was a teen ager. So I wrote his mother a sympathy letter like a good Christian should.

A month later I was subpoenaed to appear in court AGAINST the Watchtower. It seems that Jason died from a suicide and Watchtower was trying to cover it up because it was in response to a gay affair with one of the Governing Body members('apostles')and to keep the parents from getting an autopsy they had exhumed the body and had it cremated and were claiming the grave never existed. BUT--I saw the grave and wrote a letter saying I saw it on such and such date, etc...

Waiting in the motel room for the trial the next day I was visited by legal reps (some 8itchy Chinese woman--colder than an ice cube)for Watchtower asking me to lie. I asked them what they would do for me if I was put in jail for perjury, they said they could not do anything since they were not even supposed to be there talking to me. so I told them I would not lie.

M had a crisis that spring and rather than try to work out how we could divide the household(after 12 yrs together it was nearly a divorce!) she freaked and had her father come out to get her with a trailer. I made some phone calls and a friend from Seattle told me he had a job for me If I wanted to come back.(It did not work out and I found myself in a shelter for about 10 days.) I was supposed to leave the day after her father arrived, but he was late. So I left before he got there.

About 3 weeks later in Seattle my realestate agent calls me and tells me she changed the locks because 'those church people' were taking everything out of my house. They stripped me to the bone. It seems that after M lied to her father and told him I was coming later to California to live with them too(hence the reason why she was taking all my furniture) she told the congregation to come in and take what was left. I called the elders and told them that I did not authorize anyone to take any of my stuff and they basically said 'too late now' and told me I could not sue my brothers and sisters.

I went down to CA and had it out with M. To their credit, her parents did not have a clue and tried there best to make it up to me. I lived with them for 6 months while I planned my physical escape. I took care of her dying grampa. M started talking to her estranged husband and when he told her that he did not want to be a JW anymore, at which point she said she could never live with an apostate--so he hung himself. They would not even allow him to have a funeral in the Kingdom Hall. And now that she was 'free' she started dating in earnest.

My uncle died and my aunt sent me some insurance money to get me back on the east coast. I met a guy, Ian, from Boston online and we had a brief cyber fling before he offered me a place to live since he was divorcing and needed a room mate to help pay the rent on his condo. I checked him out, met his parents over the phone--even talked to his X. It was not a romantic thing. But his friend, Lee, picked me up at the airport.

Lee's parents lived in the condo across the hall. Lee worked nights and came over ever morning for breakfast. I got the worst case of flu I ever had just days after arriving and Lee would come over and take care of me during the day and sleep on the couch.

Lee was pagan but cradle catholic. We were married 6 months later and still are. Ian is remarried now with two kids.

So it took a murder, fraud, theft, a trial for wrongful death, and a suicide to get me out of JWs.

When I was finally out and away from JWs and I was able to actually see the lies in their dogma--I was shocked and disgusted and never regretted walking away from them for a single moment. Ian's parents were big time UUs and professors at Brown and Harvard, and they loved me. So I got to read books and look at files and microfiche and basically convince myself that it did not matter a rat's a$$ what JWs did to xtianity since it was all a load of total $hit anyway!

I lost every friend I ever knew, family, pets, my home, most of my belongings. Am I bitter--you bet I am!

Ravyn Guiliani

---------------------------------------------------------

UPDATE 2006:

My grandmother died over a year ago and I did not attend her funeral, my sister made sure I got a few of her things to remember her by. I never talked to my grandmother again after the big fiasco in 1995. She didn't know who I was anymore, it was as if I never existed.

My 44-yr. old cousin Ruth Anne, who was not a JW, died of liver cancer (a common consequence of Porphyria) a few months before my grandmother and I had not seen her in 15 years and only called her the week that she died because of my father and that cursed religion.

Here is the last letter I wrote to my father, I have not heard from him since, but occasionally he will make some nasty remark that my gets back to me when my sister relates it to me.

Dear Dad,
Now I will be completely honest with you, it is the only thing left I have to give you.

The reason I am emailing you rather than calling you is because I would find it too difficult to talk to you on the phone right now. I still have some issues with you and our relationship. The only thing I regret about emailing is that I can't be sure that you are really getting this and R (non-JW step mother from Hell) is not deleting it, or changing it. I really don't even want her to read it---since I am writing it to you, not her--- but I know that would be unavoidable. Since I was already a grown adult before you even met her,  I don't feel any obligation to think of her as a 'step' anything. I tried to be her friend, but for the most part you are the one who ruined any chances of that with all the stories you told her for years about your 'previous' family. So I don't blame her entirely, but she is not a very nice person. And I don't see how we can be friends if she insists on seeing me as her enemy (I don't care enough to her enemy--neither of you have ever given me the chance to care enough to find out if I am an enemy or a friend!) But enough about Ruth, my issues are not with her. They are with you.

I was hoping that after nearly 20 years you might have been able to see past the delusion of the whole religious thing. I am still angry about your arrogant comment about my wedding and confirmation in the Catholic Church. I was very sick that year, sick enough for a priest to think I was going to die and give me an emergency baptism--they don't do that on a whim you know! And all you could say was that you 'were not happy about it'? What arrogance! And coming from you of all people! You have not publicly lived according to the JW rules since you 'committed adultery' and remarried. (I don't care about your reasons nor do I think you necessarily did anything wrong--- I don't put any store in their rules anyway--- BUT YOU claimed to, and still do--and THAT makes you a hypocrite.) Did you inquire about my health? Or try to see me? No...all you did  was pass YOUR judgment on me and then it took you more than a year and the death of your mother to attempt to get in touch with me again? You don't even know what my experience with the Catholic Church means to me--and it does not mean what you probably have concluded. I do not consider myself Christian, and have not since about 1993. But you don't know that, because you have never cared enough to ask.

Now the other issue I have with you, might be a little unfair on my part. But since my childhood was wasted in a cult, and I was isolated from family and other non-cult members except for a few that YOU deemed to be acceptable(outside of religious rules--but then those were not for us were they? they were only for the 'weak' ones...)< yes, I did just indulge in some sarcasm--- I have a great deal of bitterness over my lost childhood--- and YOU were the controlling factor in all of it(Mom would have left JWs in a split-second if you said you wanted to)--then yes--I DO blame you. And this is it. I was very close to Ruth Anne (cousin who died of liver cancer) as a child. Closer than I was to K because of our ages. And because of JWs I was separated from her when we moved to Atlanta. The chances we might have had to get back together after we became adults were obliterated with your hatred for Mom. You made MOM'S family side against her. You could have just left her and gone on with your life, but no--you had to DESTROY Mom. That is despicable.

And you destroyed more than Mom. (And no matter how much of a failure she may or may not have been--she did not deserve what you did to her.) You kept me and Ruth Anne apart. If I had not called her on the phone and spoke to her less than a week before she died--I would not be emailing you now. In fact I would never talk to you again. Have you no ethics? What business do you have, having ANYTHING whatsoever to do with ANYONE of Mom's family--- the same family you arrogantly rejected my whole childhood and kept me from knowing--- AFTER you left Mom? I don't care if Ruth knew them from work or not---that is unethical. And as far as I am concerned Ruth should have had the decency to not pursue a friendship with them. That is just bad-form and tacky. The whole thing reeks of Jerry Springer.

Now, about Nanna. The year you decided you wanted to be reinstated and so came out with the allegation of Mom being a lesbian (IF it was true why didn't you come out with it when you were disfellowshipped in the first place instead of waiting years?) You made a comment to the Chattanooga Body of Elders that maybe M and I were also lesbians. I called them and they told me that YOU said it--- and it was in your own defense trying to justify your remarriage. Now at the time, I was still a regular pioneer, and it was passed along to my Body of Elders and I was actually 'talked to' about it! What utter nonsense! (However it was an effective distraction to my objections to your accusations of Mom and your subsequent reinstatement.)

I called Nanna about it, asking her if she knew what you had said about me. She backed you up, and before it was over, Nanna told me L and K (uncle and aunt) were also involved making some stupid comment about how M and I slept on the same couch bed when we came to visit(where else would we sleep? at the time they were living in a pig sty because K was a nutcase and we came to help them--- I did nothing but laundry for an entire week and bought goodies for the assembly that L was too proud to let his kids eat--- I was thanked for this effort by not being invited to D's (cousin) wedding.) I confronted Nanna about it (on the phone) and I basically forced her to admit that she did indeed believe and perpetuate the rumor--- she said she had to support her son. Our relationship was never the same again. The last 5 years of her life I spoke to her maybe 3 times. I have not spoken with L and K or any of my cousins since. YOU did that.

So you have isolated me from any family I had, ruined any chances I might have had to even get to know R-stepmother (or M-gay stepson) without her suspicion and mistrust and back-stabbing spite, you have judged me according to rules you yourself can't keep, and you continue to hurt Mom and K (sister). That business about selling Nanna's property could have been sorted out for everyone's benefit, especially by a realestate agent, but I suspect that since you could not get the land and the house from Mom, that you washed your hands of it knowing it would be a hardship to sell it to strangers without considering the property lines.

You could have fairly made the divorce arrangements in the beginning, thinking of K's future, but no you had to make up some fantasy to justify yourself to a bunch of religious cultists. For what? To be considered an outsider for the rest of your life? To sour your new family with that old garbage? You should have just left and started over. You did not need any excuses for what you did. Who were you trying to impress? Who would you have lost?

Well, now you lost me. I honestly don't know if it can ever be fixed between us with so much that can't be undone now. You built a whole life on lies. Twice. The first one on other people's lies, the second one on your own.

I hope you don't believe in Karma, because it ain't looking too good for yours right now.

Ravyn

PS: K does not need to be involved in our issues. I do not discuss this with her. She told me when you called her on the phone and yelled at her about the last email I sent you about the wedding. I don't appreciate that.

---------------------------------------------------------
been a long and winding road, a long, strange trip.
But I am still here and most of the time I am happy. My health is always an issue. I have 'other' problems besides the JW thing...because of my health we are a one-income couple and it means we don't have much in the way of material things now, and are only one-paycheck away from disaster. And my husband has his own issues, that include in-laws from Hell for me. So money and in-laws---things that everyone might have troubles with. Still searching spiritually. Sometimes I wish I could disconnect my insatiable need for this and just enjoy existing. But I can't.


end part 1.
I will get back to you-I will have to think about it.

RavynG

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Re: Everyone Please Welcome RavynG!
« Reply #22 on: February 11, 2011, 03:10:00 PM »
here is part 2 taken directly from my book:

PROLOGUE

I sat cross-legged on the floor, between the bed and the dresser drawer pulled out as far as it would go, my back against the bed rail, sorting through the baby-doll clothes, many of which were at one time my own and my baby sister's.

Always was the nagging sense of fear in the back of my mind making me hyper-vigilant. Always I discreetly glanced to my exits. Judged the distance between me and door, me and the window, how high up was the canopied bed--could I dive under it or would there be junk to stop me? Could I leap over it or would that be too much acrobatics to be effective? Would I be diving or leaping right into the arms of the demon I was trying to avoid? Where was Mom? Did I hear her in the kitchen washing dishes at the sink--playing out the nightmare scenario of my repeating dreams? Or was she in her bedroom sorting laundry oblivious to the terror just a few feet away? Could I out-run the demon and get to her in time? Or would she turn and look into my face and scream and fall over dead like in my worst nightmares? Or even worse than the worst--would she turn and I would see it was not Mom but the demon I ran to, instead of her inconstant safety?

The only thing that let me know I was actually awake and not dreaming was the cold shiver that ran down my spine- with the cold trickle of sweat that ran down the back of my neck- when I heard the sound in the closet.

Two closets, neither held any clothes. Just the toys the demon used to possess and torture me with. Dolls and stuffed animals I loved and pleaded with to protect me, but they were powerless against him. They were just dolls. The unfinished closet--not more than just a framed-in space between my bedroom and my parent's at the end of a hallway that ended short. A haven for spiders, crickets and mice; with exposed wiring and insulation just waiting to electrocute me or catch on fire at the whim of the demon. The closet with all the boxes of board-games and puzzles and blocks and Lego and Colorforms stacked up to the ceiling like some anachronistic 'Jenga' tower waiting for me to pull one box out and have them all fall on me like the wicked playing-cards fell on Alice. The closet where unspeakable things happened. The closet with no door to close it off, just a curtain to swell and ripple with evil breaths in the dimness of a single nightlight that my mother inadvertantly made worse by occasionally putting in a red or green bulb because she thought it was pretty.

(Probably some Freudian slip from her subconscious that secretly missed Christmases and wanted me to have them like she did when she was a kid.) But in reality the red glow made the fires of Megiddo burn in the dollhouse windows and the green light gave everything a ghostly death glow.

But it was not a sound from THAT closet, for surely I would have had the courage to run screaming from my room if I had heard a sound come from THAT one, as I had done before only to collide with Mom's legs. Or bounce off the doorframe; and have her tell me how stupid I was, and to go back in there and play by myself and stop being a baby!

No this was a sound from the other closet. The REAL closet. The one with the folding louvred doors that always stuck and came off track and gave you splinters because they were still unpainted. The one with all my dollies in it (to keep them safe from the crickets and mice in the unfinished closet.) The one with the light-switch on the same wall-plate as the bedroom ceiling light when I walked in the doorway and reached to the left as high as I could reach. The light, that, in my dreams would never turn on. Or it would turn on and flicker with the demonic, overlapping, reverberating screams coming from the other side of my bed. Right where I was sitting now.

I tried to stop my chest from rising and falling when I breathed. I thought if I could stay perfectly still, the demon might pass me by this time. I breathed so shallowly I felt faint, but that was not the most uncomfortable part. The most uncomfortable part was that I did not blink either. My eyeballs dried out until they hurt. Then to add insult to injury the cold, salty sweat on my forehead would drip down and sting my dehydrated eyes. But still I did not move or cry or blink or dare to even show a sign of life. Not until I heard Mom in her bedroom bringing in a basket of laundry to sort on the bed.

In a berserk I flew over the top of my bed in a leaping tumble--worthy of a Ninja--landing on all fours on the other side of the canopied bed, with nothing but a few feet between me and the open door...

I scrambled to crawl out the door to safety and freedom; only to reach the fourth floor-tile when the door slammed shut in my face, and lights went out.  And I was being pulled back by my ankles by stiff, red, clawed fingers from under the bed and the overlapping laughter of the demon ringing in my ears.

The last thing I saw before the door slammed--as I looked up in horror and reached toward my mother just a few feet away was her face--twisted and transformed into a hideous mask with burning red coals for eyes and her teeth like a shark smiling at me, laughing....

I could not scream, I could not make a sound. I could not chase away the bad demon by saying God's name. I could not even pray, because it was my own fault.

Somehow I had called the demon to me. (That's what my father always said.) He was my own demon. Like a Guardian Angel. And my demon loved me. He saved me again. I was safe with him and I trusted him.  He kept the bad ones away.

I was 6 years old and this was not new. I experienced this terror on a daily basis. It was a terror that no 6-year old little girl should have ever had to experience.

OVERVIEW
My grandmother was involved with Jehovah?s Witnesses since the 30's when Judge Rutherford was claiming to get his information from angels and channeling Pastor Russell the founder, and we had literature back to the 1890's. My father became involved in the occult aspects of the religion. Egyptology and channeling angels and demons and Masonic stuff. There was a book he had that I think was called 'Angels' about a demon who had lived in a materialized body at the time of the flood and he had had a wife and family. My father frequently 'taught' me things of this dark nature with the proviso that I did not tell anyone at the Kingdom Hall because they were not mature enough to understand it. If some rule of the JWs chafed him he would ignore it in private saying that it was made for the weak ones not 'us'. I was told that it was Jehovah's Will that the sun dominated the day and the lesser luminary dominates the night. So during the daytime we worshipped Jehovah and at night we worshipped Lucifer. And Lucifer was once an angel of Light and Beauty and could still look like one. But it was just a family feud of sorts and dad taught that when hell was emptied in Revelation that Jehovah would reconcile with this Son too. He said Lucifer was the Prodigal Son. And only the 144,000 would be invited to the feast to welcome him back. Of course my father believed he was one of them. My grandmother knew these things also. My mother knew about some of it, but she was not a very 'faithful' witness, so she was not privileged with the info like I was.

I was groomed from a baby to be trained to take my place at my father's side as his aide. He told me that we were Nephilim and this was the reason we had Porphyria. There were a few others in every congregation and I would see them occasionally at picnics and gatherings, sometimes at clearings in the woods around our home. There was one man who claimed he was the reincarnated Jeremiah. This was in southern New Jersey in the late 60's early 70's. My father?s mentor was from California and supposedly taught my father everything he knew in the late 1950?s before I was born. Some years later as a young adult this mentor took me in also for a few years when I lived in the southern California desert in the 80?s.

part 2 cont...
« Last Edit: February 11, 2011, 04:25:10 PM by RavynG »
I will get back to you-I will have to think about it.

RavynG

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Re: Everyone Please Welcome RavynG!
« Reply #23 on: February 11, 2011, 03:14:58 PM »
part 2 cont...

But the earliest known experience I had with my demon is not really my own memory but the ?story? I have heard both my parents tell my whole life.
I was about 18 months old and had a nightlight next to my crib. One night my mother heard someone brush the lampshade and awoke to see a cowboy lounging against the bedroom doorframe. She woke my father and he saw the figure also. But then the figure turned toward the glow of the nightlight and disappeared and they both saw the door of my bedroom close and the light go out. Dad rushed in to find this spirit heavy in presence standing over me asleep in my crib. The story goes that my father chased him away from me that night with the name of God. But apparently my father had the opportunity to rethink this choice because soon I was ?given? to this demon as a channel and a few years after that as a consort.

At age 3 I was put on stage at the assembly and by age 5 I was giving my own talks on Thursday nights in the Ministry School. And staying with my father during his elders? meetings with the special circle of men, while mom took my sister home and left me to sleep on the floor. I was special. And I was treated like I was special by all of them. I was not abused or molested; I was adored by all of them. I was treated better than their own children and most of the other kids were jealous of me. It was my job to ?call? the demon and to tell them what the demon told me to say. I was an oracle. I was used to let them know what they were supposed to do.

I spent a lot of time at Brooklyn Bethel also. At least once a month dad would take me along , usually with other brothers--starting in the night-early morning (I remember watching the sunrise over the city) and we would go to 124 Columbia Heights. I used to practice my piano lessons on the piano there. I remember sitting on the President's lap and other Governing Body members always teased me. Many of them were very good friends of my father. We spent a lot of time in the cemetery at the Farm too. They called it the 'launching pad'. I remember them having a 'Memorial' there ---bread and wine and we all ate it. I was the only female and the only child there.

I was baptized May 25th 1974 on my father's birthday, one week after I turned 12. He did not want me baptized. But I had a part on the service meeting encouraging kids to take a stand and when the brother asked me what my future plans were I said I was getting baptized. I remember my father looking at me like he was going to kill me from his seat! It was the last bit on the meeting and there were other kids up there and the brother announced the song number and told us to stay seated up there. It was weird but I don't think he wanted me to sit by dad again.

And immediately afterward the elders surrounded me still on the stage and started making the arrangements to go over the questions with me--it was like only a couple of months before the assembly. My father had no choice, but he changed toward me and became almost cold from then on. I remember one older elder being in bed drunk with the bottle of wine on the floor next to his bed asking me part of the questions. He asked me if I had started menstruating yet and when I said no he was smiling and said that was good. Then he said he was sorry and started crying and dad took me out of there.

I got baptized at New Hope Assembly Hall and a GB gave the dedication talk. One other high-up was there too. And dad was with them in an elders? meeting and had to leave them to see me get baptized. My mom did not bother to come out to the baptism pool to see me, she stayed in the auditorium with my sister. I took a rock out of the parking lot and wrote the date on it with a magic marker. I never did figure out why I didn't get a gift like all my friends subsequently did when they got baptized.

Things changed at home and with dad after that. Mom slipped away into the shadows and I started taking over her role. I was keeping the checkbook and making supper and I was not going to public school because I got mysteriously ill and did not walk for 3 years. Dad acted as if he hated me but he was afraid to do anything or say anything ?wrong?. I was writing his Sunday talks for him from society outlines and typing his notes from elders? meetings. I even worked behind the magazine counter. I don't know of any other female who was allowed behind the literature desk at the Kingdom Hall.
I started my period that next January and I was told by the elders not to let any brother touch me. One really sweet brother who had 8 kids of his own used to hug me and told me one night that I smelled good---my cousin had bought me a bottle of cologne---and I was warned to not ever let him get near me again!

At 14 I had a crush and he told me he loved me too but he was not allowed to. They moved away shortly after that.

The boy next door?s father was one of the brothers who would meet in the woods with dad and the others. The boy and I were basically ?betrothed?. He was 4 years older than I was and they would make sure that we were put in compromising situations. Nothing ever happened, because we grew up together and he really did love me. And when he turned 18 he ran as far away from it all as he could. He ended up marrying a girl who looked so much like me that my father saw her years later in a store and thought she was me! He got heavy into drugs and struggled with that for years. The last time I ever saw him was the day we left NJ when I was 15 1/2. He had been my only friend my whole childhood and we didn't even get to say goodbye properly.

Something happened when I was about 15 and we left NJ a few months after. I don?t know for sure what happened the first time but my father?s reputation was involved. It felt as if my father was running away in disgrace. We moved from place-to-place for a few years--each time my father would end up in trouble somehow and having to move us. Always some excuse about where the need was greater or whatever, but most of the time it was some irate husband wanting to kill him for fooling around with his wife.

My mother was almost invisible by this time. My father and I became more and more isolated in the family. I went with him to give talks in other Halls and they would assume I was his wife, not his daughter. Even if my sister came with us--they thought I was her mother! I was only 4 years older than she was. Dad kept the boys away. I know of atleast one whom he paid (the guy told me later), and a few he threatened.

We kept moving all over the US. There was always an inner circle in every congregation we moved into. Sometimes we were absolutely adored and sometimes we were jealously hated. I was always involved in secret meetings and rituals with my father.

Finally when I was 23 my parents moved one more time and I did not go with them. Within a year my father had left my mother and my sister was pregnant and married and they were all thousands of miles away from me. I stayed with JWs for another 11 years, living on the West Coast, Pacific Northwest and also in New England. When I did leave JWs I went to the ??dark-side?? openly and became a practicing witch. I figured if I could not beat them, I might as well join them.

end part 2.
I will get back to you-I will have to think about it.

RavynG

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Re: Everyone Please Welcome RavynG!
« Reply #24 on: February 11, 2011, 03:23:17 PM »
my editor suggested that certain details be vague and others be pronounced. so it may seem odd to XJWs what is emphasized and what isn't. but if you have any questions I will answer them and I do have an interview on Six Screens of the Watchtower in the archives if you are really that interested.

Ravyn
I will get back to you-I will have to think about it.

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Re: Everyone Please Welcome RavynG!
« Reply #25 on: February 11, 2011, 04:25:54 PM »
This is the "satanic rituals at Bethel" chick right?


*blink blink*
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Re: Everyone Please Welcome RavynG!
« Reply #26 on: February 11, 2011, 04:27:58 PM »
Holy crap that's a lot to read lol gimme some time with this
"And Hellpuppy is well Hellpuppy. lol  Bad things usually happen when we lynch him and Jedi put a big bullseye on his back. " - Will

RavynG

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Re: Everyone Please Welcome RavynG!
« Reply #27 on: February 11, 2011, 04:40:05 PM »
long story short:

born 1962, baptized JW 1974, (I was involved with my father and other elders and GB in Brooklyn/NJ with Satanic Rituals blended in with the "old school" JW stuff--it stopped when I got baptized)

1974-1980 I was very sick with Lupus (I also have Porphyria) and family started moving every few months all over the US (the excuse was to serve "where the need was greater")

pioneered May 1980- Dec 1995,

1985-1993 I was on my own with JWs--family had left (father was DF'd and divorced mother, sister DA'd) and I started to doubt,

really tried to make it work from 1993-1995-but it didn't, lots of emotional trauma in congregations,

last year in 1996 (planning my escape), left physically Feb. 9, 1997,

got involved with the Unitarian Universalists and Paganism/New Age approx. 1997-1999,

1999-2000 I was involved with Mormons--LDS and I was baptized but never went to Temple,

2001 I started RCIA with the local Catholic Mission so I could be married in the Church and get baptized and confirmed,

2002 emergency baptism because I got very ill again and was confirmed a few weeks later and married a couple of weeks after that, I was born again but left unfed when we moved away and did not find a Church in the new place.

2003-2011  I am still searching. My current obsession is Apophatic Christian Mysticism. And voodoo.
I will get back to you-I will have to think about it.

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Re: Everyone Please Welcome RavynG!
« Reply #28 on: February 11, 2011, 04:54:11 PM »
What of Rosicrucianism ?
"And Hellpuppy is well Hellpuppy. lol  Bad things usually happen when we lynch him and Jedi put a big bullseye on his back. " - Will

RavynG

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Re: Everyone Please Welcome RavynG!
« Reply #29 on: February 11, 2011, 05:01:00 PM »
What of Rosicrucianism ?

they hate sex. sorry I can't do vegan or celibate.

Ravyn
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Re: Everyone Please Welcome RavynG!
« Reply #30 on: February 11, 2011, 05:03:36 PM »
You are interesting ;) :wolf6:
"And Hellpuppy is well Hellpuppy. lol  Bad things usually happen when we lynch him and Jedi put a big bullseye on his back. " - Will